Just wanted to know everyone’s thoughts on cigar Internet sales and the new Online Age Verificaton.
:smiley21: :smiley20:
Thanks,
Shel
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Just wanted to know everyone’s thoughts on cigar Internet sales and the new Online Age Verificaton.
:smiley21: :smiley20:
Thanks,
Shel
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shel
You got something to hide??? :smiley23:
Why should it be any different online vs. when you check out at the local gas station?
My thoughts? I'm thinking it's just a way to comply with the law.
I agree, in fact I feel there should be a heightened level of scrutiny for online sales of tobacco and alcohol. I am not convinced enough is done to ensure minors are not purchasing tobacco and alcohol online.
I think this was the weirdest first post I've ever seen.
Also I order everything from porn to beer online and I've never been ID'ed or asked anything about age online. When I was in high school, if I knew it was easier just to order bourbon online vs. buying it through older guys, I woulda ordered online. :smiley37:
Sometimes, that system doesn't give the right information.
Age verification is always a good thing. It legitimizes industries.
When I was working in the game biz, there was a lot of buzz about the ESRB ratings on video games. Quite simply, many games are NOT intended for little kids. However, no one pays attention. Some stores are FINALLY starting to check IDs! That helps the industry focus more on creating entertainment for different ages and less time dealing with nutjobs that don't understand that Grand Theft Auto is NOT a good game for your 10 year old!
By verifying age, you're ensuring that your product is getting into the correct hands.
If it helps to keep the cigar nazis from regulating online sales...I'm all for it.
Shel - On Club Stogie you posted you were looking for answers because of your company, is that not the same here?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shel
You’re right Sir. I have inquired about advertising as well as opening up discussions about the topic of Age Verification on the Internet and thank you for you input.
I STILL say it's a SHITTY system, very prone to errors. Who will FIX the errors once they are proven to be there?
I'll bet it will be harder than trying to fix a credit report and 99 times out of 100 THEY are wrong and inaccurate.
How does it supposedly "verify" ages? What a fucking joke!
Okay, so you scare some idiot like TBSCigars into thinking they aboslutely NEED your product or they can get in trouble with some governmental agency.
I would like to know if the governmental agencies who are coming down on say, tobacco or liquor retailers give two shits if they used this BS systen you're selling.
As I have pointed out, I cannot see how in the hell this "product" you're selling can confirm with any degree of confidence that the purchaser is indeed of age.
If I were some law enforcement officer or ATF agent who was busting some enterprise for selling to underaged person and the enterprise said "Well, I used 'VerifyME' to verify the buyer's age." I laugh right in his face as I hauled his ass to jail!!
As far as tobacco sales go, what would be the advantage of a system like this over a credit card? Credit cards are deemed legal proof of age 18+, which I believe is the tobacco age throughout the US..
Superchuck is correct but I have a question.Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperChuck
I have never looked into this but what about the debit MC/visa? I think you can get those under 18 because there is no contractual debtor/creditor relationship. When those are processed as credit transactions do they verify the age of the account holder? I would doubt it but I don't know exactly.
I think it's a pointless excercise. It's not going to work; it will not convince the nanny-stater fascists of anything. The next step in controlling our lives will likely be the banning of all tobacco sales online. Either state by state or at the federal level.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cigar no baka
what no c-bid. NOOOOOoooooooooo
I'd like to know what system you're using; the system I know is imbedded in a Shopping Cart and works automatically. And provides a confirmation number for each transaction and has a 1 million dollar liability bond. Are you using anything like that?
Shel
I don't know if you can get them under the age of 18. It would seem that signing a credit card slip would be a binding contract, regardless.Quote:
Originally Posted by nhcigarfan
But I also think I had a checking account at 17 and a check is a binding contract...
Elves or gerbils?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shel
According to my CC processor and two other vendors that where trying to get a merchant account they were told they can’t get online CC processing with out an AV system in place and if that’s so what will the next move be by the CC companies?Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperChuck
CC companies have the lobbyists and lots of power.
Typically, minors can contract; however, most of those contracts (unless they're for necessities) are voidable by the minor. That's why most places won't issue credit cards to them. Until Shel gives us some specifics on how exactly this thing works, I don't see how it can work any better than assuming that credit/debit card = 18 years old.Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperChuck
And I'll ask you AGAIN:Quote:
Originally Posted by Shel
Please give an answer, not a sales pitch.Quote:
I would like to know if the governmental agencies who are coming down on say, tobacco or liquor retailers give two shits if they used this BS systen you're selling.
Also, you should realize that, to the best of my knowledge anyway, there is only one of us with this type of concern. But I will withhold his name for obvious reasons.
Well I'm no expert but as I mentioned it is imbedded in a Shopping Cart and works automatically. And provides a confirmation number for each transaction and has a 1 million dollar liability bond per transaction, I guess by retaining the confirmation number you’re protected.Quote:
Originally Posted by croatan
But what is embedded in the shopping cart? How does it know you are at least 18? Do you pay a company to say that you're 18? How does that prevent minors from using their parents' computers to order? If they've got access to a credit card, don't you think they can get access to a computer on which a cookie is stored telling the online merchant that the purchaser is at least 18?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shel
Thanks for not mentioning my name :smiley2: , hey I'm learning from you guys.Quote:
Originally Posted by nhcigarfan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shel
Still some to learn.. I wasn't talking about you.
It doesn’t work off cookies or care what computer you use it verifies each transaction base on the information inputted and I assume if you’re 18 or over your on file and can be verified.Quote:
Originally Posted by croatan
That's why I'm a Junior Member, I thought you were just kidding.Quote:
Originally Posted by nhcigarfan
Here are a few tips:
We know you're trying to peddle this system
We get about 4 slimeballs per week trying to pull the "I found a great place to get cubans online and thought I'd share" game.
We're a smaht bunch of guys
I'm a programmer, several of the guys are lawyers, CC is a mob enforcer or something. Explain how the system works and you might get some interest. Double-talk just ain't gonna work.
This piece of shit STILL won't answer my question.
I would like to know if the governmental agencies who are coming down on say, tobacco or liquor retailers give two shits if they used this system you're selling.
I'll leave out the "BS" part so it doesn't look so offensive. I musta hurt his feelings...
That's NOT a typo or a spelling error. Everyone talks like that in Rhode Island and eastern Massachusetts.Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperChuck
However, on the other hand, THIS has quite a few spelling and gramatical errors.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shel
First off, you forgot to put a period after "you use" and "it" These are two different sentences.
It's "based" not "base."
It's "you're" not "your." What makes this error pathetic was you had it right the first time when you said "you're 18" but then screwed the pooch with the "over your."
BTW, you really need a comma between "over" and "your(sic)."
Hard for me to take a salesman seriously when he can't speak or write.
Threadjack:
CC come to chat man, or clean out your pm box. :smiley37: :smiley36:
Sorry for the interuption.
JackOff: :smiley36: :smiley36: :smiley36:
I'm 20 and routinely visit my local smoke shop, but almost all the online retailers I have visited say that you have to be 21 to do anything. This includes some brand websites that prohibit anyone under 21 from visiting (not that it really stops me). I guess they're just trying to protect themselves, but like casinos I can't go into because I'm under 21 (even though gambling is legal at 18), it annoys me. I've only got about 3 more months, and I don't drink at all.
Sad thing is, I actually did that subconsciously...Quote:
Originally Posted by CoventryCat86
I had to translate for Shel, whose company is based out of East Providence (pronounced: Rum-fid).
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperChuck
LMAO!! Odds are he didn't even think twice about it!!:smiley36:
Actually, the reason for this is that they sell alcohol to players, and are classified as bars.Quote:
Originally Posted by Iced T
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoventryCat86
I’m not fishing for contact info or leads; my company has the means to target any audience. I was only trying to gauge the response if they did and hear what you guys had to say. I am an occasional cigar smoker but wouldn’t attempt to converse on you guys level.
My original question was; (Is Online Age Verification a Good Thing for the Industry?) I believe yes, and here’s why; the credit card companies are refusing new merchant accounts for online sales of age restricted products unless the merchant has and/or uses an online age verification system and retains each transaction age verification confirmation. There is no such thing as being (grandfathered), the CC companies are saying anyone who is selling or taking orders via the Internet no matter if they are (keying In), Swiping or using a Shopping Cart will be required to use the government-issued ID database to be in compliance with age verification laws and guidelines.
A company with the initials RJ is using the same system to verify age before they will send product information or coupons.
Does this mean merchants that are selling these products will loose their merchant account tomorrow or in the next 12 months, no one knows.
How much work is it to manual check IDs, have the customer send in a copy of their DL or rely on a shipper to get an adults signature. Would it not be easier to have an online Shopping Cart that check automatically so you can get on with the business of supplying a quality product knowing you’re in compliance and bonded up to one million dollars per transaction for only .50 cent?
From reading the postings most of you are not vendor or resellers but if under age children are buying these products shouldn’t you as consumers want an age verification system be used? This is only a topic of discussion, please don't be mad at me for expressing my views.
If you want to gather information for your company, I suggest you LISTEN.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shel
How does your system WORK? What is this AUTOMATIC?
This guy is simply amazing:smiley29:Quote:
Originally Posted by Shel
CLICK HERE and see if you see any similarities between his post here and his post on ClubStogie.
Shel, it's PERFECTLY CLEAR YOU ARE NOT HERE TO LISTEN TO ANYONE.
So how about you just piss off and stop bothering us. As you admitted here and on ClubStogie, you have little or no interest in cigars so how 'bout you just stop wasting your time and ours?
I am sick and tired of heaing your sales pitches and continued bullshit posts.