Some advice for people seeking that which is not easily obtained...

[ggiese]

In a private message, someone asked me about my opinions of online Cuban cigar sources a few months back. I would like to share what I wrote back:

The issue is not so much what I do or do not do when it comes to ordering cigars. It's very much what YOU should do or not do when ordering. While very tempting from the outset at some very nice deals, you really should see, hear, experience all of the sights, sounds and smells of any cigar board (particularly Smokers) and keep your ear to the ground while you're here. It's no big deal for me to list a set of URL's you may want to use - but - the reason people are so protective of those URL's is because everyone really hates to spoil a good thing. If every member that walked in was immediately given "the list" - it would not take long before those sources were no longer available. But - you will develop that list over time - trust me in that...

And - unless you really know what you're doing (no - not think you know, but REALLY know), you will definitely get burned (in so many ways, it's hard to put into writing). Too many have bought one thing only to later learn they'd bought something entirely different. There was a very recent dust up on another cigar board - which actually factionalized the place - because someone bought very rare cigars only to be horribly burned with some very poor fakes. Thousands of dollars was floating around - many are still trying to recoup their losses - and people are still very pissed off that things went the way they did. I look at the situation as humorous - because I saw all of the earmarks of a truck coming that was going to flatten some people - and they were not even the least bit aware it was coming (despite the very loud sounds of blaring air horns well before the crash happened). And the incredible arrogance of that group made the crash that much sweeter for me.

The best thing that has happened by you stumbling into Smokers is you're amongst some of the most incredible people you will ever meet - that's why we defend this place so staunchly. Sit back, relax and enjoy the company - and you never know what kind of useful information may come your way... Just have patience, grasshopper.

If your purpose here for is to develop sources, be forewarned - You will not find comfort in this community - please move on now to another board. There are several out there that will cater to your whims.

If you're interested in the mutual camaraderie of cigar smoking - you've found a great place. Primarily because we do not offer comfort in this community for those that are focused on developing sources above developing friendships.

Bottom line: the people that are the core of this place (FOG's), value friendships more than they value sources.

...and if you're intent upon using this boards resources (i.e. PM, chat rooms, etc) to do your box splits/purchases/trades covertly - knock it off now. If I get wind of it - I will be the first to bring it out into the community so that you can face the scrutiny of those that will not tolerate bringing this board down because someone was righteously burned for not heeding proper advice.

[Paddy]

In a private message, someone asked me about my opinions of online Cuban cigar sources a few months back. I would like to share what I wrote back:



If your purpose here for is to develop sources, be forewarned - You will not find comfort in this community - please move on now to another board. There are several out there that will cater to your whims.

If you're interested in the mutual camaraderie of cigar smoking - you've found a great place. Primarily because we do not offer comfort in this community for those that are focused on developing sources above developing friendships.

Bottom line: the people that are the core of this place (FOG's), value friendships more than they value sources.

...and if you're intent upon using this boards resources (i.e. PM, chat rooms, etc) to do your box splits/purchases/trades covertly - knock it off now. If I get wind of it - I will be the first to bring it out into the community so that you can face the scrutiny of those that will not tolerate bringing this board down because someone was righteously burned for not heeding proper advice.

George, from now on I will check with you first before I PM anyone about anything !!!!!!

[ggiese]

George, from now on I will check with you first before I PM anyone about anything !!!!!!

I fear you will never understand the concepts I've laid out for you.

...and in that, I see that you will not enjoy staying in this community.

You're at a fork in the road, my friend. Which path will you take?

[logan37]

Well put, George.

When I first signed up here, I was a little like that. Soon after, I learned there is much more to cigars then that. And I'm still learning.

[Paddy]

Secondly the ONLY reason I PM’ed the member was he listed An ISOM on the draft.
The person I bought my ISOM’s from in a box split specifically stated that the member gave him the questioned source. I asked because I would NEVER EVER put an ISOM as a puts that I was not 100% sure of. I figured his came from the same place, George take a forum poll. Outside of you and the member I have never, ever asked anyone shit about ISOM sources.
YET I have done many trade, box splits and outright purchases and this forum and have always lived up to my end and than some.

[ggiese]

Secondly the ONLY reason I PM’ed XXXXXXX was he listed An ISOM on the draft.
The person I bought my ISOM’s from in a box split specifically stated that XXXXXXXX gave him the questioned source. I asked because I would NEVER EVER put an ISOM as a puts that I was not 100% sure of. I figured his came from the same place, George take a forum poll. Outside of you and buzz I have never, ever asked anyone shit about ISOM sources.
YET I have done many trade, box splits and outright purchases and this forum and have always lived up to my end and than some.

Before you step further down this path, please stop and smell the flowers - contemplate what's been said - and take it to heart. I fear you're seriously missing something...

[ggiese]

Well put, George.

When I first signed up here, I was a little like that. Soon after, I learned there is much more to cigars then that. And I'm still learning.

I'm embarrassed to say - I, too, initially thought that way as well. As a child - there are all kinds of temptations in a candy store. I'm afraid the child in me was not well curbed...

It took a bit for me to realize the value in these communities. ...and, more importantly, the values in the communities that really mattered.

[Paddy]

George, Why the attack on me ?
I asked you a questioned, You answered it. I left it alone
I asked two people to cleean the in box and here are the messages I saved in word

this was nelsons
Nelson,
Espero que hayas tenido una buena visita con su familia en México.
Cuando vi las fotos que envió empecé a estar allí.
He crecido muy infeliz con la vida en los Estados Unidos y no puedo esperar para ir a México a tiempo completo. ¿Le resulta difícil volver?
Paddy
this was freds
I'll try calling over the weekend. I have his number as well.
I'm guessing about the problem, I know for a fact back surgery was his reason for being out of work.
He said to me the problems where due to medication related to the surgery.
Paddy
SEE NOTHING about ISOM's

[Paddy]

I understand You jumped down my throat for nothing
I was trying to answer a question fred asked
and I was asking Nelson about his holiday in mexico with his inlaws.

[Eville]

Paddy, you should probably step back, take a breather, and try reading the original post, particularly the response to your PM, one more time.

[ggiese]

George, Why the attack on me ?

The "attack" on you is for you to contemplate what you're doing, and why you're in this community. It is a bit unsettling for me that you're not seeing the trees through the forest.

You and I both know there are more than a few PM's going around at the moment concerning some purchases you've recently made - and a question about the legitimacy of the source. ...and - some thoughts around the potential need to be redress within this community if it's determined you've been burned.

You were give some sage advice initially - and you chose to take some chances beyond that advice. Now you're thinking that because you've potentially been burned - the community should assist you in making it right?

Is that truly fair to this community, Paddy?

[ggiese]

Paddy, you should probably step back, take a breather, and try reading the original post, particularly the response to your PM, one more time.

I have mentioned several times it would be in his best interest to smoke a cigar, and pair it with an equally complex libation, so that he could relax and sort out what's been said. Unfortunately, it appears Paddy is not letting any of this sink in...

Pity...

[ggiese]

I understand You jumped down my throat for nothing

Does that make sense to you, Paddy?

Would I "jump down your throat" (as you say) for "nothing"?

Seriously - you're making some very serious leaps to conclusions that are just not there...

Don't keep doing this, Paddy. It's not good...

[Paddy]

I never asked anyone about a sourse except the member & George.
LOOK at the exchange thread another member posted Monte 2 split
I excepted. the member name came up as the person recomending the sourse.
I got the smokes 3 months ago. I was suspect all the time. When I like fishes
posted pic of his cohibas there was a lot of chatter about fakes. I asked george to take a look at mine as I was sure they are not real. he said he did not have time I understood. I'll just smoke them none the less, I left it alone. Then the draft I notice the member puts an ISOM. I say maybe its from the source he recomemded. I simply asked the member if he had legitamicy issues. THAT was all I did.

[Paddy]

Point taken - I'm going to take a break for a few hours and calm down

[ggiese]

I never asked anyone about a sourse except BUZZ & George.
LOOK at the exchange thread cigarbear posted Monte 2 split
I excepted. Buzz's name came up as the person recomending the sourse.
I got the smokes 3 months ago. I was suspect all the time. When I like fishes
posted pic of his cohibas there was a lot of chatter about fakes. I asked george to take a look at mine as I was sure they are not real. he said he did not have time I understood. I'll just smoke them none the less, I left it alone. Then the draft I notice BUZZ puts an ISOM. I say maybe its from the source he recomemded. I simply asked BUZZ if he had legitamicy issues. THAT was all I did.

[prophetic_joe]

George, Why the attack on me ?

Paddy I was aware of some of the things going on here, however nobody put an attack on you specifically. A copy of a response pm was put in the OP and nowhere in that post was your name specifically. You called yourself out here.

That said, I agree with what others have said above. I too got here and thought about this community in the wrong way, I believed it was just a place that could help me and didn't think how can I help it, I believed it was just about smoking cigars. I was wrong. I don't post all that often as I am the type that doesn't see a point in speaking unless I really have something to say but I have been here quite awhile and love this site dearly. You need to think about your questions, your passes and anything else you do here and ask "how does this help or hurt the forum" "what are the potential drawbacks?" Until you can think of this place like a home and somewhere you want to take care of you will never truly belong here. Like I said I don't post a whole lot but I love this site and I'll be damned if I let someone fuck it up.

George and others before me have already told you and I will reiterate, you are at a fork in the road, choose your path.

[prophetic_joe]

Point taken - I'm going to take a break for a few hours and calm down

Good choice.

[cigarsarge]

George is dead on in his summation of what the board is and the brotherhood we have established. My advice to anyone that comes here is take your time and get to know the guys. Good things come with patience. We can be a tough bunch. It's for a reason...

[Paddy]

George,
I am truly sorry if I have done something wrong. I have never asked anyone to make this right if indeed the where fake. I stated to you in an email those are the chance we take.
My first email to you thee months ago was to ask about a website I saw a full page as in smoke magazine. I used the search function on the forum and a thread with your handle came up. I asked because they seemed too good to be true. You did give me sound advice.
All I wanted last week was for you just to take a look and give me your opinion. I stated in the email I was never going to look for restitution. The truth is I don’t care for myself.
I just wanted to know so I never used a FAKE in a pass or trade. Again I am sorry if I did something to hurt the forum.