Muslim Democracies in the Mid-East

[hoodere]

Oh how refreshing, middle-east democracies coming into their own. I thought a comment was appropriate following Iran's elections last Friday. Of course Iran has a more" mature "democracy, having killed off or imprisoned the "loyal opposition". Now Palestine and Iraq are following in their footsteps.
I am so proud that our country is sacrificing so much blood and treasure in pursuit of Bush's lofty dreams.
Our troop have earned our nations highest honors, gratitude, and respect. They have provided the Iraqi's the opportunity to establish a constitution, and elect a government, and establish new military and police forces. The current situation in Iraq is the Iraq's own doing. Let them have it their way.
We should remember that after our country gained a desperate and hard fought independence, tens of thousands of loyalists were burned out of their homes and run out of America into Canada and elsewhere. And that what followed under The Articles of Confederation were years of civil strife, armed uprisings and economic chaos. In desperation a new constitution was ratified which was hard won. We were then launched into a civil war less than a century later. Our democratic struggle has been neither easy or cheap, nor is it complete.
Should we expect less of Iraq.
Time to bring the troops home, they have done their job.

[Monk]

Oh how refreshing, middle-east democracies coming into their own. I thought a comment was appropriate following Iran's elections last Friday. Of course Iran has a more" mature "democracy, having killed off or imprisoned the "loyal opposition".

Now are you talking before, or after, Iran's original democracy with its lawfully elected head of state that the U.S.A. deposed and installed the puppet Shah who was malleable to the U.S. will for oil?




-W.

[hoodere]

Now are you talking before, or after, Iran's original democracy with its lawfully elected head of state that the U.S.A. deposed and installed the puppet Shah who was malleable to the U.S. will for oil?




-W.

Point well taken, we really did put the screws to-em in 1953, as we did in Guatamala about the same time, and Chile later. However I was referring to the puported "democracy" established after the Islamic Revolution.
I do wonder what Iran would be like today if the democracy they had still existed today. So much for nation making.

[jiaguy]

I heard a fomer Bush analyst say: "Iran does not want its Government but its does not want the US to interfere even more." I was surprised...at his analysis, I'd have though he'd wanted to institue the draft and liberate Iran too.

But I think Iraq would be alot better if it split itself like Yugoslavia did. It was one 'd up place now its got more check points than the west bank but at least its making progress. Let there be a Kurdistan, and a nation for Shia and Sunni, they could form a federation of Former Iraqi states or something.

[Monk]

I heard a fomer Bush analyst say: "Iran does not want its Government but its does not want the US to interfere even more."

Hmm perhaps an analyst that might actually understand the nuances of the region. This is actually the feelings of many Middle Eastern States. The thing that people in the west fail to percieve is that "forcing" democracy on the region will never work. They don't like people meddling in their personal business. They are also keenly aware that the U.S. is only interested in the oil and democracy makes a good excuse. They resent that, and this is a region with a long history of "an eye for an eye". The region is in many ways very young in the context of the "modern world".

Saudi Arabia was a bunch of tribes just over 100 years ago. I mean seriously, the cultures there haveuch a completely different history to the west that people over here just don't get it. There is a rich history as well as a bloody one in that region and all of it combined makes it very different to our cultures and way of thinking. They are fiercely independant. No one gave a rats ass for the region and they made it on their own, suddenly they are oil rich and everyone wants to be their friends... you think they are idiots?

-W.

[cigar no baka]

Hmm perhaps an analyst that might actually understand the nuances of the region. This is actually the feelings of many Middle Eastern States. The thing that people in the west fail to percieve is that "forcing" democracy on the region will never work. They don't like people meddling in their personal business. They are also keenly aware that the U.S. is only interested in the oil and democracy makes a good excuse. They resent that, and this is a region with a long history of "an eye for an eye". The region is in many ways very young in the context of the "modern world".

Saudi Arabia was a bunch of tribes just over 100 years ago. I mean seriously, the cultures there haveuch a completely different history to the west that people over here just don't get it. There is a rich history as well as a bloody one in that region and all of it combined makes it very different to our cultures and way of thinking. They are fiercely independant. No one gave a rats ass for the region and they made it on their own, suddenly they are oil rich and everyone wants to be their friends... you think they are idiots?

-W.

This gives us every reason to find alternative energy sources to oil. Imagine a day where oil is worth $2 a barrel for certain industrial uses, and all cars run on fuel cells, batteries, etc and we get our energy from sources other than oil. It will happen one day, it may not be in our lifetimes though. Then they can sell their oil for $2 per barrel and run their own lives. I can't wait for both to happen.